Why do we need health-care reform? Everything is just fine the way it is.

Typical snarky lib comment.

Shhhhhhhhhh. You're gonna give conservatives a bad worse reputation.

Ya know, i aint ta gud at inglish maself, but dat was a gud un:) Most agree that we need reform, its the manner on how we achieve it, not whether we do it or not, so lets take that as a given. Even the democrats have their disagreements, which is why there is what is called debate, yes I know those that disagree with Pelosi are obviously being paid off by those nasty insurance companies, only Pelosi and her 50 million dollars is pure.

It seems quite fashinable to claim that if someone has reservations with the form of the House bill they must be conservative since the bill is perfect. Pigeonholing people is convenient but not realistic. I am sure that even liberal Democrats disagree about things, be kinda boring to only talk to people who have exactly the same opinions about everything. Why not eliminate debate in the House altogether, since they have the votes why bother even voting on measures, someone comes up with a bill and Pelosi can just speak for everyone and declare it law the same day, now that would be efficient, imagine how fast bills would fly out of Congress

We need health care reform now too many private insurers are not paying the bill that they should be paying. Nothing worse than thinking you are covered then have some smart azz insurance lawyer tell you "Just because you have been paying your premiums it dosn't mean you are covered". In my case I had been paying them for years.

Then they "f" you I hope they disappear

Great Seed. Jonathan Alter is somehow who knows from whence he speaks.

Translation: He agrees with your far left views.

No genius, he's had cancer.

N/S thanks for pointing that out! He had cancer...good for him.

Jonathan Alter's experience with cancer and dealing with the insurance industry puts him in a unique position to express an opinion on the healthcare reform debate. And he makes some excellent points (by using sarcasm and reverse psychology).

Very good article...thanks for the seed. I hope a lot of people read it and realize the stupidity of the arguments against healthcare reform and the public option.

Jonathan Alter's experience with cancer and dealing with the insurance industry puts him in a unique position to express an opinion on the healthcare reform debate.

Of course it doesn't. Millions of people get cancer every year.

And those millions of people have had to deal with the health care industry, including insurance companies...their experiences are worthwhile inclusions in this debate.

And those millions of people have had to deal with the health care industry, including insurance companies...their experiences are worthwhile inclusions in this debate.

Of course they are.

You used the word "unique". This man is not "unique" in his situation.

He is unique in that he has a national forum as a Newsweek columnists to speak for all those cancer patients who have had to deal with a corrupt and dysfunctional health care and insurance system. That is what I meant...maybe I could have worded it better.

Can you or anybody on the left point to ANY statistics released by a government or reputable bodies which breaks down this 47 million figure ?

I can...

The 45 million uninsured number that the President and others have discussed comes directly from the census bureau 2007 numbers...(look at 2007 total)

People Without Health Insurance Coverage 2006-2007

A recent Gallup poll shows that the percentage of uninsured Americans has increased since 2007, so that number is higher now...

Gallup - About One in Six US Adults are Without Health Insurance

Page 6 of this "Americans At Risk" study done by Families USA shows that 79.2% of the uninsured in 2007-2008 were from working families...

Americans At Risk

The 45 million uninsured number that the President and others have discussed comes directly from the census bureau 2007 numbers...(look at 2007 total)

Those are figures that breakdown for income and ethniticity. The figures for 47 million or whatever figure they are using today can also be broken down another way. 10 million are eligible for Medicaid and for some reason have not signed up, this is important when calclulating the cost of the new bill since the states will be taking on some of that burden, which the bills authors have left out. Even when the bill becomes law those on Medicaid will continue to be on the expanded Medicaid, nothing changes for them, assuming that all of a sudden they decide to sign up for what is a free program. Then there are 10 million who for some reason dont want or dont think that they need insurance, some of them might even be willing to pay a fine, as they do in Mass at this time. Some of these 10 million actually make over 50,000 a year and have different priorities, and then of course some people are here illegally but we wont go there. So the government might be, in small way, exaggerating the numbers to make it more striking. That is not to say we dont need reform, but both sides stretch the truth in their own way.

I saw a woman at the teabaggers hate fest and she said it right into the camera.

Here's the truth about the make-up of the uninsured...

The 'Real' Uninsured

But even if the uninsured number is only 1 million...that's still too many Americans going without health care because they are afraid of losing their home, their childrens' future, or going bankrupt because of their medical problems.

But even if the uninsured number is only 1 million...that's still too many Americans going without health care because they are afraid of losing their home, their childrens' future, or going bankrupt because of their medical problems.

The House bill will still leave 5pct without insurance according to their own reports. Some people will still choose not to take insurance and pay a fine. The problem is that it is impossible for the government to calculate how many fines will be paid, so cost analysis for subsidies for those who do will be off, could be by billions. In Mass they still have 2.6 pct uninsured which is a good number but you will never have 0 unless the coverage is free to everyone, which it wont be under current proposals. Of course the Mass situation is 30pct over budget and is in trouble, not my opinion but the opinon of the state treasurer when he appeared on CNN

"the acceptable standards of heatlh care" in Tennessee

Nice try....TennCare is going broke! Also, when did "profit" become a bad thing in this country!

How many more innocent people will die because of the greedy status quo ?

Probably ZERO! Lell me one person in this country that died because they didn't get medical care! GET A CLUE!

I am sure those "fact finding team" didn't have an agenda, did they?

You can believe what you want. As for me, the less government in my life, the better!

The majority of IOM studies and other activities are requested and funded by the federal government

The IOM is your Institute of Medicine....funded by THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT....nice!

greg

Where are your facts? Where were you when GWB was expanding government and actully raising our debt ceiling, a dirty little fact that is never mentioned ?

I didn't see rants or tea parties then?

The GOP got to enact all of their dream policies and what did the American people get?

Wars, Unemployment, Economic Collapse, Alienaton of our Friends and Empowering our Enemies.

One of the problems is the government will artifically under-cut private insurance. This will cause companies to drop coverage. Then we will all be on Obamacare. Most of us don't want that. Sound simple to me....

Medicare is awsome , if you have supplemental insurance, really wonderful. I have friends who have no supplementary , can not have the Doctor they would prefer if they do not accept Medicare only patients and wait for hours in the office and days for results sometimes. Look up MDVIP... a new option...your Dr makes house calls...is available 24/7 on his cell phone...you wait about five minutes in a cushy lounge with cold drinks and snacks (healthy) and your appointment can last an hour if you need. You have e-mail access too. Cost about......130.00 extra a month. I would starve rather than give this up at my age.

Medicare is awesome, full of fraud and in debt you jackasses. IT IS BROKE. When will you liberals wake up to the fact that someone has to pay for this stuff. We can not continue to print worthless money. If the government is a big teet to suck dry, who plans to feed the cow????

It is awesome for them because they didn't pay for it!!! ARGGGG!!!!

You think that everybody who disagrees with you pays no taxes? That is a common right- wing FALSE assumption. A LIE. So what other lies do you want to spread today to achieve your agenda? Seems like the right never runs out of the smear and fear factor.

I can imagine one of those "end of life counselors" in some type of Gestapo looking uniform, giving you the bad news.

Those are lies that the Republican party is telling you about advisement on making 'living wills' and such... here is the truth...

False Euthenasia Claims

Greg are you a tax accountant?  The majority of wealthy people in this country do not pay income taxes, and if they do it is not as great a percentage as you pay.  They have so many deductions and write offs, plus they hid their money in banks overseas.

Costs will go down, if the insurance companies want to stay in business.  The richest Americans under Bush received 3 tax reductions.  What did you receive?  The people without insurance can not afford it and do not qualify for medical assistance.  The insurance companies receive federal welfare now, from or taxes.   How many Doctors have not paid their student loans back? 

BLAH BLAH BLAH-I want what the rich have but I won't get off my fat a$$ and get a job. I want what doctors have but I don't want to have to get educated. I want all you disgusting mean people to pay my way in life because you have more money than me. AND IF YOU WON'T GIVE ME MORE MONEY THAN YOU ARE -- A DISGUSTING, MEAN HATE MONGER.

You can rationalize all you want...read my lips: IT ISN'T THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENTS JOB TO PROVIDE HEALTHCARE.

When I say provide, what that means is they are taking money from one group and give it to another. Like Obama says "Gonna' spread the wealth around".

(its sucks to make minimum wages in LA, San Fran and New York) .

Don't worry the FED will step-in with SECTION 8 HOUSING, FOOD STAMPS...you name it!

If you are making min. wage and you are an adult, you are a freaking looser!

Greg, Because of people like Kennedy back in the sixties telling this country you can have a family with no money-we the government will help-hell, even have that family with no husband or job-we'll take care of you and your kids. I know a woman who works part time pays about 500.00 into the federal tax system and at tax time claims her three illegitimate children and receives $3500.00 in a refund. That is called the 'earned income credit'. This is what liberal democrats have created. A population of generations of people that think they are entitled to be subsidized by the government at others expense. I can name two families that I know that now the grandkids are having babies out of wedlock and getting assistance. Grandma started getting assistance in the early 1970s. Name any thing liberals have touched that has turned out for the good of this country?? They want criminals to have rights. Now they have more rights than victims. Our criminal justice system is a joke. Illegals come to this country and suck us dry and they will be soon rewarded with citizenship. Soon we will be taxed at 46% of our income like some parts of Europe in the name of equality for all whether you contribute or not.

Liz,

Preachin' to the choir! I know about the EITC. It is a huge government re-distribution of wealth sceme.

My nephew got his 18 yr old gf pregnant. She had the kid. I asked my sister about how the girl was taking care of it financially. She said the goverment pays all but $50 a month for a luxury apartment, along with food stamps, WIC and who knows what all else. She could have stayed with her parents, but why pass that up, right?

Health care is a right...not a privilege. It should be available to everyone, young or old, rich or poor. You people who don't care whether other people survive in their day-to-day worlds are very scary.

Agreed, People are willing to give up the freedoms given to them by our founding fathers.

The disease is labeled being "Progressive".

In realty to give up your freedom is to gain a master.

Agreed...

"Progressive" is another word that the left corrupted. It sounds like it should be a good thing...after all "progress" is the root word. But, what is really means is progress towards a totalitarian system were the government is all powerful. One step at a time. Just think, less than 100 years ago there was ZERO federal income tax in this country. Well we have "progressed" since then!

What friggin "freedom" are you talking about giving up?? The right to die in the streets? The right to lose everything you worked for all of your life because your child has cancer or your spouse?

You all spout off all of these repetives zombie talking points. How about if you do everything right and work hard, "pull yourself up by your bootstraps" b/s and have health insurance and a major illness hits you and you lose it all even with insurance? What about that you nincompoops? What if you get diagnosed with cancer and you never put down on your application that you were treated for acne years ago, guess what they can cancel you. It happens every day. That's okay with you all? Business is Business? You all are fools and pathetic to be against this reform.

Stop with the stupid rigid ideology and start to think about people, real people. It could all happen to you tomorrow. Where will you turn? What would you all do? Let you loved one die because you cannot afford the treatment. Emergency rooms do not do chemo.

The industry paid their executives 14 BILLION dollars last year. They are paying the slugs in congress to the tune of 1.4 million a day to fight this. You all are going to lose this time because it will happen. This insanity must end for the good of the American people.

Godspeed President Obama

What friggin "freedom" are you talking about giving up?? The right to die in the streets? The right to lose everything you worked for all of your life because your child has cancer or your spouse?

If I am not mistaken there are bills in Congress that have something to do with healthcare reform, or havent you followed that, what is it with this drama stuff. You will get reform, you wont be happy with it anyway, just like the people in Mass, but you will have it. Its the weekend, relax.

I was talking about the limited powers given to the federal government by that document called the US Constitution which for many many years both R and D Presidents and Congress have side step on there way to strip of us our freedoms.

Government is not the answer to this problem.

The answer lies with us not government. How about gathering together a group of investors and starting a new insurance company? Or a charity that helps those without insurance?

Think out side the box to find your answer. The Government is just a lazy persons way of solving the issue.

Socalgal-You may be on to something here. Lets say I don't want to be taxed for this government takeover plan but Margo does. So Margo and her liberal buddies go to the post office and pick up a withholding form to have money with held from their pay check to fund a non profit that gives to and subsidizes all who don't have insurance or who are under insured. They will be happy to give and everyone will have health insurance. Not a good idea Margo?? It's all about spending my money and not yours right??

Where was my form to exempt my tax money from being given to Halliburton in order to screw our soldiers? Where was my form to exempt my tax money from being given to an administration that tortured people in America's name? Where was my form to exempt my tax money from being given to "abstinence only" programs that actually increased the number of unwanted pregnancies?

I was against the war myself. What a croc. Why do we need to bring Bush's mistakes into this. He was a jackass and I hate him. This bill is about ME & MY rights and MY HEALTHCARE. Why do you have a problem with my idea?? 80% of 280 million people are happy with their healthcare and do not want the crooked government competion that will result in the death of our healthcare. If this is such an important issue for you-THEN HELP FINANCE IT. But that is the problem, as I've said- you want others to foot the bill. Make a difference. You liberals love to show how kind and generous you are and how mean and stingy the rest of us are. Prove it to us.

Greg you have a real problem. Why isn't your nephew supporting his child? Why didn't he use birth control. Because he is just like you, a self centered, mean person. The girl can not be living in a fancy apartment. Your sister is not telling the truth and neither are you. I feel sorry for your wife, living with you must be miserable.

Iam woman, The section 8 housing in our town is fairly new with washers and dryers and central air in each unit. Probably what you would pay $750.00 to $850.00 per month for if you had to pay for it yourself. But they don't they pay around $50.00 depending on how many children they have etc. Yes, as I said in previous posts -I pay for medicare and Social Security that I will never see when I retire because the government has never been able to handle any program successfully. My tax dollars pay for food stamps, welfare, medicaid, and even those reeeeeal nice apartments I was tellin' ya about. Say I'm mean, say I'm stingy, I don't care. I'm not paying any more taxes. It's time for you to be the generous, caring, sweet person that you think you are. Read post #13.6 and start getting your ideas and purse together.

you want others to foot the bill

Not at all...I pay over a thousand dollars a month for health care insurance...and still have to pay high deductibles, co-payments, and argue with the insurance company over every bill. I don't mind paying...I just want to get my money's worth.

It is kind and generous to want every human being to have medical treatment when they need it even if it means we pay taxes ...it is mean and stingy to scream about wanting illegals to die and poor people to die because you don't want to pay taxes.

Like I have said that is your right to want to give everyone in the world the same healthcare as you have. Read my post #16.6 again. I pay for all the social programs I have listed in other posts and I'm not willing to allow the government to tax me to have another fund, like Social Security, to loot and waste and expand government with all the agencies that will be needed to run something like this. Let them fix the system we have without making another.

You are disgusting! You and Greg should get together and breed hate.

Go get a job and be productive instead of holding your hand out for the next freebie.

I hope you lose your insurance so you can understand

That is a rather strange attitude to have for a compassionate person.

Margo.....I see how Obama got elected now!

I did loose my insurance for two years. Guess what...I went to the clinic (you know the one poor folks go to) and I think the co-pay was $10. I finally got back in my chosen field after getting laid-off and selling cars for 2 years....and I took ZERO unemployment.

So I know what's up. Now stop ctying and go earn some profit!

So then the government should force changes in the healthcare system that exists. AND then fix those that they already run. All of you that want this big waste-and thats what it will be AGAIN LOOK AT MEDICARE - MEDICAID- what like 508 billion in debt or something like that. If I loose my insurance-Oh and by the way do you notice how when you point something out to a lib they must attack you and wish something bad for you-like a spoiled child-I will buy another plan. I'll do with out that new car or house I can't afford to take care of myself WITH OUT A HANDOUT FROM SOME ONE ELSES HARD WORK. 5 million on welfare-that is only because they have work for welfare programs now. How many million on section 8 and food stamps and are still add to their already large families?? THAT IS THE BIGGEST WELFARE ABUSE OF ALL. Look I'm not saying that the system isn't broken, it is. But letting them have another fund to loot (like Social Security) is not acceptable and we will fight this tooth and nail. God help my reps when they come home.

oops ...stop "crying"

I do pay $100.00 for an emergency room visit and a percentage of every other test they might perform as my co-pay. What is wrong with that? Should it be free margo?? Oh yea, thats right you think it should be. Should I just tell the hospital -I have a car payment coming just go ahead and bill my Uncle Sam-he's loaded with cash. Margo-get a real job and pay your own way-it is the American way to do it. Remember you idiots- you get what you pay for.

It might cost you $100 for an emergency room visit, but it doesn't cost an illegal alien anything. Also, the so-called healthcare reform bill specifies illegal aliens (who don't pay in) get the same benefits as everyone else.

The healthcare reform bill does not include illegal aliens...that is a lie. Please stop lying.

H.R. 3200 includes a provision that specifically says that there will be no federal funds spent to cover illegal immigrants:

H.R. 3200: Sec 246 — NO FEDERAL PAYMENT FOR UNDOCUMENTED ALIENS

Nothing in this subtitle shall allow Federal payments for affordability credits on behalf of individuals who are not lawfully present in the United States.

I was something that said otherwise.

Besides, you can put all the lipsick you want on it. It is still a pig.

I "saw" something.....(brain-fart)

The illegals will get the coverage when they and their very large families are made citizens. For free I'm sure. That is the dictators next move. Those votes from the illegals, who will now be citizens, will be needed by the democratic party to hold on to their power. That bill will be another one of the dictators hurry up and pass it today bills. He'll have a hard time using his usual line--We need to do it today to save the economy.

Hey Greg

Do you work in the Insurance business?

No...I work for a defense contractor.

I am 55 years old and I have voted in every election since I was 18 and mostly for republicans.

Btw, $100 is just for walking in before they do anything, you owe 100 dollars. The bills are a lot bigger, 500, 1000, 100,000, who can pay that if they are unemployed or poor?

President Obama will win, the American people will win. It a new ball game and we came to win. Whether you all like it or not. You can keep what you have. How hard is that to understand?

In my state we have medicaid for the very poor. The veterans have the VA, unless they make enough money to afford healthcare (according to the VA) If they are service connected disabled at even 0% they still have lifetime rights to VA healthcare. Then we have 2 free or very, very cheap clicics in town for the working poor. I live in a small town!! Bigger cities must have many more options. Most of our hospitals in our town and neighboring towns are owned by Valley Health. If you are a single person and make under $20,000. they will waive all emergency or hospital stay fees, regardless of the treatments/operation. They furnish you with a letter after they do this so that you can get any doctors to waive their fees too. I bet if I looked harder I could find many more ways that the uninsured could get healthcare for themselves in this country.

margo,

I appriciate you upbeat outlook. At least you aren't going all negative.

If the dems have their way, within 5 years they will make it impractical for anyone to have private insurance. Have you heard Nancy Polosi? She straight-up hates the insurance companies! It is nuts!

Liz,

That is so true...You keep hearing about all of these people "dying on the streets", but I have never heard of anyone dying (or being denied care) because they couldn't afford it!

With good reason man. Look, this is the first time in my married life, I have been married for 35 years, my husband and I worked at the same company. They closed our office. Poof gone! I have a auto-immune disease, and my husband has high blood pressure. We have run out of money, we lost our home we've paid in for 15 years. We are UN-INSURABLE GET IT? WE CANNOT GET INSURANCE. NONE, NADA.

My husband got a job finally in December at a small company they promised health insurance at three months, but when the time came they said "Sorry" profits are down (we found out later they were down by 12%) One guy's wife was in the NICU with a preemie at the time. Then a month later said that he was putting the sales team (4 guys, my husband is one) on "contract" and could only pay them commission and not the base salary that was negotiated. So here we are. He is trying to find another job but because he was 62 in April he is having a hard time, too old. I have periods when I cannot function due to my disease and it's complications. My medication is over 500 dollars a month. Oh and I cannot get disability, I was turned down. So what do you suggest we and millions more with similar stories. Just shut up and die in the streets because of some ideology that has whipped people up to hate our government? What do you suggest we do? This public option, yes option, you can keep what you have.

And this objection to paying taxes, when we were working at the peak we were paying 45,000 dollars a year in Federal taxes alone. We have paid, my friend, and not we need the government to step up and give us a chance at BUYING health care insurance.

'

Sorry about your tough jam! I didn't say that nothing should be done. It might be nice if there was some kind of program for people in your position. I just don't think the answer it to force government regulated HC on all of us. Which is exactly what they are doing.

The bill doesn't force government healthcare on anyone since it is not a "single payer" plan (I wish)....it just allows a public option for those who wish it...here's a good article on it...

Government Running Healthcare?

Here's another good article about the false argument that having a public option will put private insurance companies out of business...

More Health Care Scare

Those of us who have read the proposed health care reform bill have several problems with it....it still gives too much power to the insurance companies and it doesn't provide health insurance for every single person in America. Other than that, it is so much better than the current system that there is no comparison.

I should accept that you have read the entire 1000 + page bill while the majority of congress and the senate have not???????

Have you? Seriously everytime a con brings a page up saying it means something bad or sinister, I read the page and it has never turns out to be the bogeyman the right says it is.

They have a month to read it. If your conservatives cant read all of it ,thats rather illustrative of their reading comprehension .

What??? Do you read what you write before you post??? The right has enough since to at least read something before they sign it into law........can you say that about your friends??

PCMan

I bet you haven't read it.

Yes I have read the bill. In one of my jobs, I was a legislative analyst who read bills and analyzed them for various committees for financial impact (yes, believe it or not, the congress have entire staffs whose job it is to read bills...they don't have to read every word themselves although they lie about that too). I am an avid reader...I read approximately 10-15 books every week.

Last week, my elderly aunt was hysterical because she had been told the lies about how the health care reform bill was proposing killing seniors and taking away doctors and all the other lies that have been put out by the right-wing. In order to help her, I read the entire bill (HR 3200) so I could talk to her honestly about it. Even so, it took me two hours to calm her down and assure her, and show her passages to prove it, that the health care reform bill does nothing bad to anyone...it is a decent bill (I wish it were stronger).

It infuriates me that irresponsible people think nothing of repeating lying talking points for political gain...when it terrorizes real people...like my sweet, innocent, elderly aunt. They need to stop now!

"redsfan" is that like a fan of Russia?

So, do you work for a democrat?

I know my insistence on facts is getting you upset, greg, but I am actually a retired accountant who was never really interested in politics until a few months ago when I found out that our government actually tortured people and weren't even ashamed. That's when I decided to start paying attention. Does that help you put me in a box? Or would you like to discuss the issues?

redsfan,

I wasn't trying to put you in a box, I was just trying to get a perspective.

BTW...accountant would be the worst job match ever for me. I could never get a balance sheet right!

until a few months ago when I found out that our government actually tortured people and weren't even ashamed

You just found that out? We have been doing that since the Republic started, Clinton did it different, he sent them to Saudi Arabia where he knew what they would do. How about this one, its much cleaner and better: Today we send drones into Pakistan to "take out" suspected terrorists, but of course sometimes civilians inconventiently get in the way and when they get killed by missles its called "collateral damage" The reason its so much better is because Americans dont get killed, but the pilots, thousands of miles away get to see the collateral damage on their video screen in living color. In fact more civilians have been killed by these drones than the entire population of Gitmo. The civilians are happy that they arent tortured since its a quick death and they die in the knowledge that the missiles have a D for democrat sign on them as opposed to a nasty R for republican on them.

That is a silly talking point, they WRITE THE DAMN THING, OF COURSE THEY KNOW WHAT IS IN IT.

Why is it that the righties can never read any bill and say that they have no say? I watch C-span and they come into hearings and drop a few negitive and usually false statement, which btw, are disputed by the people testifying before the committee and then leave. They are not interested. period. They have huge staffs, and they voted to keep the staffs of GOPers that lost the last election, so they have even more help to do it. And you believe everything that they say? And if you are implying that the democrats don't read their own bills or know what in is in them, WHEN THEY ARE WRITING THE THING THEMSELVES???!!

Only a few on a committee write the bills they don't all participate in writing each bill.

Do you think they all sit down a huge round table and write them do you?

Have you ever been to the South? That section of the country that gets back from Washington more than they pay in. The South has the fattest people.

Have you ever been to the South? That section of the country that gets back from Washington more than they pay in. The South has the fattest people

I dunno, my son and his wife live in Portland Ore, otherwise known as Porkland, since it rains so often there is nothing to do outside for months on end.

You mentioned that you could not obtain healthcoverage due to pre existing conditions, I do not know what state you live in, but in California, at least a group of 2, small business can get coverage guaranteed to issue, regardless of medical conditions. I have seen a husband and wife, form a business, file for a business name with the state, create a business, if your husband, was for instance an independent contractor, and you and he could get group coverage. I say this because the public option, if passed will not kick in until 2013. I informed my cousin, whose husband had cancer and couldnt get coverage, he had a small business, selling T shirts, put his wife on the payroll and they have group coverage. Just a thought, if you need more details, let me know.

There are ways to get coverage besides having the Government involved. Margo, you asked for solutions I gave you some before they require us the people to be involved, Lampell has given you another way to gain health insurance but it involves THINKING OUT SIDE THE BOX.

I hope you get insurance however, it is not fair and it is against the principles on which this country was created to have the government involved in insuring you.

You have a passion use it to start a charity to help those who say they can not locate insurance. The charity can pay for part of the premium and may be able to strike a deal with the insurance companies to give a discount if you get enough people to enroll.

Or take it one step further, go get investors and start an insurance company.

The Government is a lazy persons answer to the people.

They need a risk scale like auto insurance.

They have it.

but in California, at least a group of 2, small business can get coverage guaranteed to issue, regardless of medical conditions. I have seen a husband and wife, form a business, file for a business name with the state, create a business, if your husband, was for instance an independent contractor, and you and he could get group coverage.

The rule you refer to is actually federal law (HIPAA). The practice is not uncommon, and is easily doable by anyone.

With good reason man. Look, this is the first time in my married life, I have been married for 35 years, my husband and I worked at the same company. They closed our office. Poof gone! I have a auto-immune disease, and my husband has high blood pressure. We have run out of money, we lost our home we've paid in for 15 years. We are UN-INSURABLE GET IT? WE CANNOT GET INSURANCE. NONE, NADA.

First, let me say that you have my condolences. This is why I believe healthcare reform cannot come soon enough.

Let me frame this idea in a different way. Part of my business is HR and compensation consulting. Every day, clients or prospective clients tell me they want a (whatever it is) plan. I never take them at face value. They don't want a (whatever it is) plan, they want what they think that plan will do for them. Once I get to the bottom of what they want to do, 3/4 of the time the thing they are sure they want will not do the job half as well as something else that they just didn't know about.

Here is where we find liberals on the healthcare debate. They don't want government health insurance, they want better, safer health insurance for less money. They have convinced themselves that the only way to get that is with government healthcare.

We could get it better, faster, and cheaper with insurance law reform. Had the government option, which the President NEVER promised while running for office, not been in the bill, then it would already be law, probably going into effect January 1, and you could have your insurance.

As it stands, if (big if) they are able to pull that off, you won't get your government plan until 2013.

Finally, let me put this thought in your mind. You believe insurance companies don't care about you. You're right. They don't. News flash...your government cares about you less. Now, when one of my clients has a difficult problem with an insurance company, I can pick up the phone, call the Texas Dept of Insurance, and get things resolved. When one of my clients got his kidney transplant denied by medicare, there was nothing we could do and nobody to complain to.

The rule you refer to is actually federal law (HIPAA). The practice is not uncommon, and is easily doable by anyone.

Actually not, California enacted that law along with the Exchange in 1993, was the first in the nation to do so. The Exchange failed.

Actually not, California enacted that law along with the Exchange in 1993, was the first in the nation to do so. The Exchange failed.

A similar law was enacted in Texas in 1994.

However guarantee issue for small employers (2-50) is part of the HIPAA legislation that went into effect back in 1997, so it is now also federal law.

I'm curious, what happened with the Exchange in California?

I'm curious, what happened with the Exchange in California?

What I will describe will probably have no bearing on the national exchange, since in many states there is little or no competition. Anyway when the passed the law for small groups the state also set up the Health Insurance Plan of California (HIPC) for small groups. The idea was that small businesses could have the same amount of choice that large companies had. About 10 carriers agreed to offer products in the HIPC, with standardized HMOs and PPOs. A small business could pick and choose from many carriers and get one bill from the state, who administered it. You could go through an agent or direct through the state. Since there was already major competition in the state, gradually small businesses found it was easier to go with one carrier, and switch the next year if rates went up. After about 5 years the state sold the HIPC to a not for profit organization and it kept going for another few years and died about 3 years ago.

An "Exchange" might work in a state where there is little competition along with co ops, not sure that I am in favor of a bloated public option, especially in a state like California, which has not for profit and for profit competing, rates are about half what they are in Mass, which has universal healthcare already.

Medicare is 508 billion in debt and I wouldn't send my dog to a VA hospital. Any more bright ideas?? Google Ezekiel Emanuel, Obama's healthcare advisor, and read some of his writings on healthcare. He feels that if we treat lets say an 80 year old person for cancer it would not be in the "best interest of the community". He also doesn't feel kids with CP should be treated since it is incurable. His stuff is scary and that is why we are all a little worried. I am in agreement that our current system is broken and we should be able to fix it but government run healthcare is not going to work. Hell, they couldn't get the 'cash for clunkers' program right.

Let all the elderly who have the bejesszus scared out of them because of my post questioning the liberal garbage known as reformed health care which is totally influenced by the government, speak up !!!!

Guess what, we just went through cancer with my 88 year old f-i-l and he was in great shape, still played golf everyday. The treatment killed him. He may have lived a little longer and had a better quality if he had stuck to his previous decision of not having chemo, but his daughter wanted him to do everything and it killed him faster.

instead of scaring the bejeezus out of elderly people....

It scares the bejeezus out of me!

margo,

I actually agree with you on this one! If I am 88 and I get cancer...SCREW CHEMO! Just give me some good meds and let me ride off into the sunset!

Guess what, we just went through cancer with my 88 year old f-i-l and he was in great shape, still played golf everyday. The treatment killed him. He may have lived a little longer and had a better quality if he had stuck to his previous decision of not having chemo, but his daughter wanted him to do everything and it killed him faster.

And my brother in law had chemo ten years ago and is now in remission, so your point was?

So,Greg, then tell me why didn't one single republik vote to eliminate government
run, government administered healthcare when it was offered to them ? Why are they screaming socialist, while refusing the opportunity to kill medicare?

First off...drop the term "repubnik", it makes you sound less intelligent. And you actually seem pretty smart.

Secondly, I don't approve of a lot of what republicans have done over that past 20 years or so. They act like democrats-lite.

I consider myself a conservative. It would be nice if we had a strong 3rd party that was very conservative, but until then, I will just be a republican and encourage my team to do the right thing.

Yeah but not one republik voted for it. Not one? So is your super uber conservative party, presumably with Palin at the Helm and fox urine scented Ted Nugent as sergeant in arms going to vote to kill the socialist healthcare the republiks approve of?

Btw; I don't see why people who cant spell my parties name properly should be upset if I show the same disregard for their name.

Randy...you are so contrary!

Palin and Nugent....now that would be a ticket! Thanks for the thought. With Obama, Polosi, Fwank, Dodd and company at the helm, that might not be a stretch in 3 1/2 yrs.

Remember...It took a Carter to get a Reagan.

Why would intelligent people want to elect a party that when during the primary the candidates were asked if they believed in evolution and only three raised their hands.

Everything isn't so simple, everything is not black or white and you are so certain that you are right. That biographer of Dubya said that the Bush's "don't believe in introspection, that to them it is a sign of weakness."

Why would intelligent people want to elect a party that when during the primary the candidates were asked if they believed in evolution and only three raised their hands.

And therein lies the problem, there is no one to vote for, McCain was a weak candidate who was stained by Bush, and Obama was an inexperience candidate who said anything to get elected and who may have mistaken his mandate with this we won you lost routine, knowing it was many independents who put him over the top. Perhaps in a few years some good candidates will make their appearances from both parties.

Why would intelligent people want to elect a party that when during the primary the candidates were asked if they believed in evolution and only three raised their hands.

Maybe they had strong Christian faith. So, I guess you are anti-Christian? I thaought libs were supposed to be so tolerent?

Hell, they couldn't get the 'cash for clunkers' program right.

You couldn't be more wrong. Much bi-partsan praise for this program and expansion of it.

That program is a joke! Sure it's popular. Who wouldn't want $4000 for a worthless car! The government is giving away other people's money. You just don't get it do you?

Randy, -In case you came back today. Ever hear of Walter Reed Hospital?? A disgrace to send our severely wounded troops there. Filty hole in D.C. I work with VA hospitals every day and while some are better than others, most are way below average. Why?? They are government runs them. No incentive to be better. A take it or leave it attitude. Everyone gets paid everyday whether they work hard or not. Just because Emanuel is against suicide does not mean that his views about who should have treatments and who shouldn't don't exist.

I will be very disappointed if you let the Rinos lose with a Romney-Jindhal ticket

I think Romney would be a great pick! I don't know who would be a good VP. I think he would beat Obama if the election was held today.

It also took a Hoover to produce 5 democratic terms before a liberal republican could get in. Bush has only started to yield that for us;^)

Let's see, four of those terms were FDR...right? What was he president for something like 16 years!? We was the genesis for most of the over-bloated government programs we have now...thanks a lot FDR!

FDR and the GI Bill actually created the middle class. He made the engine that drives this country. You need to stop worshiping the weathy, you'll never be one of them.

You need to stop worshiping the weathy, you'll never be one of them.

Margo, I am really starting to wonder about you. What hakes you think I "worship the wealthy"? That is rediculas! Anyway, I might not be "wealthy" but I make a lot of money...thank you very much. I also pay a boat load of taxes. Thank you democrats.

That is rediculas! Anyway, I might not be "wealthy" but I make a lot of money...thank you very much. I also pay a boat load of taxes. Thank you democrats.

Whatever you pay in taxes, its not enough, didnt you know that?:)

You could pay 90% of your income in taxes and the progressive leaders would train their teat-sucking followers to believe you don't pay enough.